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Post by rickyrocknroller on Sept 28, 2024 11:28:23 GMT
I haven't heard the new album yet, only the two singles so far. I'm looking forward to though. Sneaking for potential ABBA recycles will probably be inevitable. I don't think of many of the unfinished Voyage songs being fully crafted ABBA recordings that were ditched and given to BAO though. The two mentioned by Benny, Hit By A Train and (?) My Story Ends With You, are probably advanced as far. It's not certain if they appear on the album though, alas they might. But I reckon most of the others probably haven't progressed this far and were abandoned earlier, like it happened before. Carl Magnus Palm has recently revealed that Nämdöfjärden became the 2006 BAO tour song Det är vi ända. The 1978 demo is just Benny on synths and was abandoned at that for ABBA. Or think about I Am The Seeker. As an ABBA recording, it went no further than a band instrumental recording with "scattered" A&F vocals of the line "I am that woman" (fascinating enough). It was considered for Chess, but then given to the 1983 London ABBAcadabra musical. In 2007, the verse got recycled again in BAO's Upp till dig. BAO3 also contains Crush On You that was written for ABBA in 1978. In this case, this hasn't even progressed far enough for a Benny instrumental demo to be recorded at Polar. (It might exist as a private B&B cassette demo, but these don't show up in Carl Magnus Palm's documentation.) So ultimately, these recycles are a win, not a loss. Considering possible Benny/BAO recordings that recycle abandoned ABBA Voyage writes in a similair manner, the strongest contender to me (so far, without having listened to the new album yet) is actually Pippilotta Langstrump from Pippi pa Cirkus. It came out in 2022 and it's clearly more a pop than a musical or folk tune, complete with funky synths. When it came out, I found it of exceptional quality for a Benny side project. When I listen to it now with the recycle possibility in mind, I can almost picture it as an Agnetha lead vocal, with low Frida harmonies in the third verse.
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Post by jj on Sept 28, 2024 14:02:42 GMT
In the same way "Cassandra" was a recycled variation of Put of Your White Sombrero, I feel ABBA's "When You Danced With Me" is a recycled variation of this BAO song:
Listen to the intro flute/whistle sections which recur through the song. Definitely "When You Danced With Me" there!
So recycling works both ways: BAO ---> ABBA (with "When You Danced With Me") and now ABBA ---> BAO (but we'll never be sure which songs went Voyage ---> BAO until/unless we hear the Voyage demos). |
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Post by rickyrocknroller on Sept 28, 2024 14:37:27 GMT
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Post by HOMETIME on Sept 28, 2024 15:22:56 GMT
I think I hear something in the Hambospolska track too. It reminds of Tivedshambo. Now I know that's a Stig Anderson composition, but there are (to my cloth ears, anyway) some moments where the new track threatens to become the old. Am I imagining it? The overlap in the titles seems to underline it.
There are quite a few ABBAesque moments on the new album. Can't say I'm loving the idea that something we might have been hoping to hear from ABBA has been repurposed for this set.
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Post by jj on Sept 30, 2024 4:28:50 GMT
Can't say I'm loving the idea that something we might have been hoping to hear from ABBA has been repurposed for this set. It sticks in my craw a bit, too. On the other hand, the songs on the new BAO album that I've heard so far, nice as some of them are, are definitely not as catchy as any of the songs on Voyage, so I'm guessing the songs repurposed for BAO were probably not as good as the material we actually did get (on Voyage). I feel better thinking like that, anyway! |
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Post by baab on Oct 3, 2024 16:10:22 GMT
You might remember that there is a guy on the German ABBA Forum who is a personal friend of Agnetha (and I've explained that it is believed as being true). He has heard short parts of both songs, namely Hit By A Train and My Story Ends With You and he states that both are not used in any way on the new BAO album.
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Post by Visitor1982 on Oct 4, 2024 8:08:56 GMT
LOL a personal friend of Agnetha...
Some fans are so gullible.
Like any personal friend would post on an ABBA forum, discussing things he heard from her...
Don't be such a fool.
Marnix
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Post by Michal on Oct 4, 2024 9:25:58 GMT
LOL a personal friend of Agnetha... Some fans are so gullible. Like any personal friend would post on an ABBA forum, discussing things he heard from her... Don't be such a fool. Marnix Unless he is Gert van der Graaf of course 😂 |
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Post by baab on Oct 4, 2024 10:17:30 GMT
LOL a personal friend of Agnetha... Some fans are so gullible. Marnix And some fans are just ignorant! I've explained it before that it is not questionable that he is indeed a friend of Agnetha, it was proven many times before. Also, He doesn't discuss any personal information from Agnetha in that forum. Song snippets are surely no personal information. |
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Post by Visitor1982 on Oct 4, 2024 10:22:20 GMT
LOL a personal friend of Agnetha... Some fans are so gullible. Marnix And some fans are just ignorant! I've explained it before that it is not questionable that he is indeed a friend of Agnetha, it was proven many times before. Also, He doesn't discuss any personal information from Agnetha in that forum. Song snippets are surely no personal information. LOL There has never been any proof. It's all nonsense. You believe what you want to believe, doesn't make it true. Agnetha is a very private person and her friends all respect that, they don't go blabbing on some ABBA fan forum! LOL |
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Post by baab on Oct 4, 2024 10:25:40 GMT
LOL There has never been any proof. It's all nonsense. You believe what you want to believe, doesn't make it true. Agnetha is a very private person and her friends all respect that, they don't go blabbing on some ABBA fan forum! LOL So who are you to know that it is nonsense? I'm in the German Forum for more than 10 years and know that He was able to proof it many times! And surely whithout "blabbering out" personal information from Agnetha! This is not the way He contributes to the forum. You don't have any clue, that's all! |
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Post by Visitor1982 on Oct 4, 2024 10:32:47 GMT
Just sad.
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Post by Alan on Oct 4, 2024 13:09:33 GMT
I'm in the German Forum for more than 10 years and know that He was able to proof it many times! I’m not taking sides here and I don’t have any intention of shutting this particular discussion down, but I was wondering how he was able to prove it? Agnetha (or anyone else) wouldn’t have sent him parts of the songs as there would then be a risk of them leaking onto the web. The only way he could have heard them is if Agnetha had played them to him face-to-face, and with no phone or other recording equipment anywhere near. |
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Post by baab on Oct 4, 2024 14:44:29 GMT
Alan, we had this discussion in another thread (concerning JLT) already and it is exhausting to repeat.
I do not know at which occasion he heard those two songs, but I know I can trust his information, over the last ten years he never was wrong.
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Post by Alan on Oct 4, 2024 15:45:38 GMT
Alan, we had this discussion in another thread (concerning JLT) already and it is exhausting to repeat. I do not know at which occasion he heard those two songs, but I know I can trust his information, over the last ten years he never was wrong. OK. I do think that people will be a bit sceptical though. I don’t know of this friend, I don’t know what proof he has, so no disrespect to him, but it has often seemed that Agnetha attracts the kind of fan that lives in their own fantasy world and will try to convince everyone (especially themselves) that it’s real. Someone mentioned Gert van der Graaf earlier and that’s an extreme example. There is, however, no proof that what this friend is saying isn’t true, so I’d have to give them the benefit of the doubt. I think I’ve found the discussion you refer to: abbachat.com/thread/1803/voyage-anniversary-royal-order-vasa?page=3 |
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Post by justabba on Oct 4, 2024 17:03:08 GMT
I have no way of knowing this story is true or otherwise, but I DO know Frida had 3 (at least) of the Voyage songs on her phone and played them to close friends - with the proviso that they couldnt have a copy or record them!
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Post by johnny on Oct 4, 2024 18:25:55 GMT
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Post by Alan on Oct 4, 2024 18:35:48 GMT
I have no way of knowing this story is true or otherwise, but I DO know Frida had 3 (at least) of the Voyage songs on her phone and played them to close friends - with the proviso that they couldnt have a copy or record them! Thanks, that would seem to support the Agnetha friend’s story, and my interpretation of how he could have heard them. You're referring to the unreleased songs? It’s a difficult one. I would hope that if they really were a “close personal friend” that they wouldn’t post about anything anywhere on the web relating to ABBA or the member they’re a friend of. It should be something that’s between them, and not for public knowledge, whether personal or not. And the other side of it is that some of the doubters could be just jealous that it’s not them that the ABBA member is friends with. “Friends” being visible on forums is always going to be divisive in terms of who believes it and who doesn’t. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2024 19:49:50 GMT
I have no way of knowing this story is true or otherwise, but I DO know Frida had 3 (at least) of the Voyage songs on her phone and played them to close friends - with the proviso that they couldnt have a copy or record them! Thanks, that would seem to support the Agnetha friend’s story, and my interpretation of how he could have heard them. You're referring to the unreleased songs? It’s a difficult one. I would hope that if they really were a “close personal friend” that they wouldn’t post about anything anywhere on the web relating to ABBA or the member they’re a friend of. It should be something that’s between them, and not for public knowledge, whether personal or not. And the other side of it is that some of the doubters could be just jealous that it’s not them that the ABBA member is friends with. “Friends” being visible on forums is always going to be divisive in terms of who believes it and who doesn’t. The one that Frida played 3 songs was Claes af Geijerstam (sound engineer of all ABBA tours, 1974/1975 europe tour, 1977 europe and australia, 1979 USA and europe, 1980 Japan). I saw "Clabe" being interviewd in 2021, before the release on september of ISHFOY and DSMD, unfortunately the video is not in Youtube any longer, but I remember the dialog with the interviewer, that was in Swedish: Clabe : Last Year (2020) I was in Mallorca visiting Frida and she played to me 3 songs in her iphone interviewer: In her iphone? Clabe: Yes, but she asked me to turn off my phone, and she said that I could only hear the songs. |
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Post by Alan on Oct 4, 2024 22:55:06 GMT
Just seen a post in a Facebook group which may be of interest:
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Post by janabbafan on Oct 5, 2024 15:28:42 GMT
I have the answer. I emailed Görel, to tell her and to forward to Benny that the whole album is beautifull! Bless her: she has never NOT answered. I asked about recycling those 2 songs in the BAO album. She answered that there is NO recycling of any recording.
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Post by bjorenny on Oct 5, 2024 16:05:21 GMT
It seems strange that Agnetha would play Hit By A Train to a friend if she didn't like it or if it wasn't any good. To be honest I'm not sure where the rumours came from re: Agnetha or Frida (or both) not liking the unreleased tracks. Also, if a song wasn't going to be released due to any of the 4 not liking it, why would it get to the stage where the vocals (and probable harmonies) were complete, and the only work still needed was post-production and mixing by Benny?
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Post by Alan on Oct 5, 2024 16:48:06 GMT
I wasn’t aware of any rumours, bjorenny, about any ABBA member disliking them? The only one that mentioned them was Benny who said they were quite good but needed more work from him. Clearly he has no intention of doing that work, or if he has, not releasing them. |
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Post by bjorenny on Oct 5, 2024 17:03:32 GMT
I can't remember where I read it, but it's probably rumour and speculation rather than fact anyway. If I find it again, Alan, I'll post it on here.
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Post by Alan on Oct 5, 2024 19:00:43 GMT
I have the answer. I emailed Görel, to tell her and to forward to Benny that the whole album is beautifull! Bless her: she has never NOT answered. I asked about recycling those 2 songs in the BAO album. She answered that there is NO recycling of any recording. No disrespect, but I doubt she would admit it even if there was. Benny wants the emphasis to be on BAO, so would have instructed her on what line to take. If she’d said otherwise, the focus would have been back on ABBA, and why on earth he couldn’t have finished and released those two (or more) songs. Someone reported on here, several times, that Görel was denying right up until the album announcement in 2021 that there was anything more than two songs. She’ll say whatever Benny and the other ABBA members want her to say. Her loyalty to them is certainly not in question. She may not necessarily even know if there’s been any recycling, but if she does, she certainly won’t be the one to say so. She knows that’s up to Benny, and it’s highly unlikely that he would (and, again, she knows that). |
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Post by Visitor1982 on Oct 5, 2024 20:35:32 GMT
I have no way of knowing this story is true or otherwise, but I DO know Frida had 3 (at least) of the Voyage songs on her phone and played them to close friends - with the proviso that they couldnt have a copy or record them! Thanks, that would seem to support the Agnetha friend’s story, and my interpretation of how he could have heard them. You're referring to the unreleased songs? It’s a difficult one. I would hope that if they really were a “close personal friend” that they wouldn’t post about anything anywhere on the web relating to ABBA or the member they’re a friend of. It should be something that’s between them, and not for public knowledge, whether personal or not. And the other side of it is that some of the doubters could be just jealous that it’s not them that the ABBA member is friends with. “Friends” being visible on forums is always going to be divisive in terms of who believes it and who doesn’t. LOL! You think I'm jealous I'm not friends with Agnetha??? Whahaha! I just know crap when I see it. No personal friend of Agnetha will ever go online blabbering about unreleased ABBA songs that he might have heard. It was the same guy who claimed Agnetha recorded Just Like That without B&B and only with Tretow and that's the reason why Benny won't release it, because he doesn't want to give Agnetha any credit... LOL! I'm mean, come one... how ridiculous is that? Anyone believing this nonsense is off his or her rocker. |
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Post by Alan on Oct 5, 2024 20:54:21 GMT
Visitor1982, Marnix, I wasn’t suggesting you personally were in any way jealous, or that I believed this “friend”. I think you were absolutely right to show some scepticism but as I am the moderator here I was trying to stay in the middle. I never thought for a split-second that your criticism of the post was remotely related to envy, but knowing the effect Agnetha seems to have on some fans, that doesn’t necessarily apply to the people on the German forum that baab referred to. I agree, the Just Like That claim was (as someone pointed out in that topic I linked to) a lot of drama.
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Post by rickyrocknroller on Oct 6, 2024 14:41:25 GMT
Thank you Alan for digging up the other thread. I have had a look at the discussion on Just Like That. I see three problems in the argumentation of the alleged friend. - Principally I agree that there could be - ane I do assume there probably are - mid/late 1982 demo recordings that don't show up in the official Polar documentation, like the rumoured 1982 Agnetha demo of Another You Another Me (the source of this is Claes af Giejerstam again, from my recollection). During this time, Benny was starting to develop his Synclavier-based solo production system instead of working organically with a band. The same time, B&B had their definitive falling-out with Stig. This might have had them to start to work more for themselves and moving away from the Polar facilities. Yet, these would all be B&B recordings, not Agnetha & Tretow. While I can't prove this definitely can't be true either, though much less likely, there are two suspicious spots: - the fan at one points claims that B&B had exploited Agnetha's alleged songwriting work on JLT from late August/early September for the later Gemini version and intended use of the song in Mamma Mia, but at another that Agnetha had contributed songwriting to the original version (May 1982, that is the three bootlegged mixes) of JLT - B&B didnt "give" JLT to Angelika Milster. This is just a German cover version of the Gemini recording the same way she had covered Nobody's Side and IKHSW. Concerning the points of prove of his alleged friendship with Agneths that you, baab, mention, I see you naming two: - that he had said in 2014 Agnetha wanted to record with ABBA again. I wouldn't say this is a proof, it could be a personal impression or wishful thinking in the aftermath of A (2013). - that he had said in 2018 that Just A Notion was to be released with ISHFIY/DSMD. This contradicts information we collected recently that JAN was only dug up in 2021 after they scrapped the two unreleased songs (Hit By A Train/My Story Ends With You) and were thus one song short for the album. Maybe someone can remind me of this information's source. If it is the more credible one, which I assume from my recollection, it's possibly wishful thinking again. It had been known in 2018 that JAN existed as a full length recording and in a 1994 Tretow rough mix. I heard rumours of this being supplied to the ladies of the ABBA Fan Club to play at a Rosendaal convention. Also, it served as a blueprint for the cover version of Rutgar Gunnarsson's tribute band Arrival in 1999. Please prove me better or supply additional points to prove the alleged personal insight knowlwdge, baab, but so far, I have no inclination to hold the claims to be true. |
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Post by Visitor1982 on Oct 6, 2024 15:45:54 GMT
Thank you Alan for digging up the other thread. I have had a look at the discussion on Just Like That. I see three problems in the argumentation of the alleged friend. - Principally I agree that there could be - ane I do assume there probably are - mid/late 1982 demo recordings that don't show up in the official Polar documentation, like the rumoured 1982 Agnetha demo of Another You Another Me (the source of this is Claes af Giejerstam again, from my recollection). During this time, Benny was starting to develop his Synclavier-based solo production system instead of working organically with a band. The same time, B&B had their definitive falling-out with Stig. This might have had them to start to work more for themselves and moving away from the Polar facilities. Yet, these would all be B&B recordings, not Agnetha & Tretow. While I can't prove this definitely can't be true either, though much less likely, there are two suspicious spots: - the fan at one points claims that B&B had exploited Agnetha's alleged songwriting work on JLT from late August/early September for the later Gemini version and intended use of the song in Mamma Mia, but at another that Agnetha had contributed songwriting to the original version (May 1982, that is the three bootlegged mixes) of JLT - B&B didnt "give" JLT to Angelika Milster. This is just a German cover version of the Gemini recording the same way she had covered Nobody's Side and IKHSW. Concerning the points of prove of his alleged friendship with Agneths that you, baab , mention, I see you naming two: - that he had said in 2014 Agnetha wanted to record with ABBA again. I wouldn't say this is a proof, it could be a personal impression or wishful thinking in the aftermath of A (2013). - that he had said in 2018 that Just A Notion was to be released with ISHFIY/DSMD. This contradicts information we collected recently that JAN was only dug up in 2021 after they scrapped the two unreleased songs (Hit By A Train/My Story Ends With You) and were thus one song short for the album. Maybe someone can remind me of this information's source. If it is the more credible one, which I assume from my recollection, it's possibly wishful thinking again. It had been known in 2018 that JAN existed as a full length recording and in a 1994 Tretow rough mix. I heard rumours of this being supplied to the ladies of the ABBA Fan Club to play at a Rosendaal convention. Also, it served as a blueprint for the cover version of Rutgar Gunnarsson's tribute band Arrival in 1999. Please prove me better or supply additional points to prove the alleged personal insight knowlwdge, baab , but so far, I have no inclination to hold the claims to be true. Jackpot! |
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Post by baab on Oct 6, 2024 16:15:55 GMT
1. I quoted about an information from a member of another ABBA Forum and also stated that it is not my own information, also I do not have any benefit from that. I do not have to proof anything! 2. This ABBA forum member Scotty posts in the forum for more than 10 years. Sceptic members came and went in this time frame quite a lot but in a huge amount of discussion which went in the same direction as this thread is heading, however, Scotty always came out as being reputable. 3. I personaly believe him over the time of 10 years of posting and discussing. What members of this Forum like Visitors1982 define as being nonsense or not is not my business and doesn't impress me at all. 4. As long as there are no further releases from the ABBA vaults or more in-depth information given from the direct sources like Benny, Mike Tretow or others we will not reveal the truth. If you rickyrocknroller do not believe that the 2 unreleased songs were not used for this BAO album, that is your Sound right, but what is your consequence? You can like the BAO songs as they are, you can speculate which song was used were and how until eternity while still not having access to the original recordings. Or they simply were not used... |
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