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Post by HOMETIME on Oct 29, 2021 8:17:15 GMT
All these people are floating voters and there are potentially many times more than those who snap it up in the first fortnight. These people would never dream of pre-ordering. The floating voters are influenced loads by radio airplay. They need the guarantee of knowing there are several songs on the album that they already like. So, Just a Notion being played on the radio is not going to result in a surge of pre-orders. The pre-order people are the rabid fans who are keen to snap it up whatever the reviews say. But there are tons more people out there who are quite lukewarm about Abba and just might buy the album further down the line if convinced by what they hear. Hard for us rabid fans to understand all this, but i t's the non-fans (who are influenced by the drip-drip of new songs on the radio and other factors) who ensure an album's sales remain strong in the months beyond its release, if indeed it does. THIS! Unlike the late 70s/early 80s golden days, the number of Serious ABBA Fans is much, much lower now. The chart performance of deluxe reissues and the live album are a clearer indication of who will buy stuff unheard. The pair of long-discussed comeback singles had both novelty value and the benefit of a globally high-profile launch. It was a water cooler moment and there will have been a few impulse buys of vinyl or downloads by people beyond the core fanbase. As bennybjorn says, those with a more casual interest will wait for reviews and/or will buy the CD when they see it in the shops, having heard a bit more. I can't think of many acts whose albums I'd buy "blind" now. There are maybe three acts whose albums I'd consider pre-ordering. And I'd say I'm pretty average in that respect. I think pushing specific tracks as singles at intervals over the coming months will be key to the album's longevity. |
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Post by madonnabba on Oct 29, 2021 9:52:26 GMT
Once the album appears in the shops like Asda etc a lot of people may pop it into their trolley as a Christmas present or simply for their own collection. Thereafter word of mouth and the concerts should ensure a healthy chart run and sales. Convinced had singles been available in the supermarkets the songs would have charted much higher...top 5 or higher.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2021 10:08:07 GMT
Hometime/BennyBjorn
Clearly pre-orders are for more committed fans. That said, no sign Just a Notion has created EXTRA interest.
Yes, Hometime, more casual fans aren't going to buy an album "blind".
But we now have Streaming. You don't have to buy an album unheard or wait for djs to play new singles on the radio.
We don't know what the other songs are like. They may be good but not "commercial" and lack airplay.
Like I said before, it is not like 1977 when Knowing Me Knowing You revitalised Arrival's UK chart petformance. We now live in the streaming era. People can cherry pick songs and not wait for djs to play new singles.
I expect Voyage's chart run will be longer than say The Visitors because sales are low. Equally I expect it to be front loaded.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2021 10:10:05 GMT
Once the album appears in the shops like Asda etc a lot of people may pop it into their trolley as a Christmas present or simply for their own collection. Thereafter word of mouth and the concerts should ensure a healthy chart run and sales. Convinced had singles been available in the supermarkets the songs would have charted much higher...top 5 or higher. I hope so. Sainsbury's have stopped selling CDs and only larger Tescos and Asdas sell them. But yes, they would help. I agree the singles might have done better if available in supermarkets |
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Post by Alan on Oct 29, 2021 10:10:07 GMT
Once the album appears in the shops like Asda etc a lot of people may pop it into their trolley Do supermarkets still sell CDs? I’ve read quite a few reports saying they were stopping, though it might just be Sainsburys. Or if they do, it’s just budget compilation CDs. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2021 10:35:22 GMT
Alan, read my post above yours about Supermarkets.
Just a Notion - a terrible choice as single. I can't see how this will encourage people to buy Voyage.
Just "talking" to people on social media. It is mocked for sounding like the Wombles, especially the intro.
The consensus is that it is not good.
Not sending out a good image. A reject from 1978 has to be a single. What does that say about the other newer songs peoole may ask.
If they wanted to re-record it, fine. But should have been a B side to one of the two previous singles. The song is truly shocking. It deserves to flop.
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Post by gamleman on Oct 29, 2021 11:01:18 GMT
I am always curious to know people's opinions on ABBA songs - their favourites and least favourites. While interesting, this is all down to personal taste, so I don't see the point of repeatedly condemning JAN (or any other ABBA track) here, when many other fans love it, even if it isn't one of ABBA's best singles. On most ABBA albums, there were songs that I wouldn't have chosen as singles... "Ring Ring" (1974), "I Do I Do I Do I Do I Do", "Money Money Money", "Does Your Mother Know", "Voulez-vous", "I Have A Dream"... yet despite my reservations, most of these songs found plenty of fans and were commercial successes. I think I am right in saying that some songs, like "I Have A Dream", are not well-liked in ABBA fan circles but still seem to have been appreciated by the general public or more casual ABBA fans. So, JAN may indeed serve its purpose and find its place in people's hearts.
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Post by richard on Oct 29, 2021 11:28:50 GMT
On the first few hearings, I was disappointed with JAN. Then l liked it more - the vocals and ending, especially. But I really don't like the intro and backing rhythm. The melody itself I find quite catchy, and I think they should have completely rethought the arrangement as I think the boogie rhythm detracts - to my ears, anyway.
I now think that using a kind-of-revamped old song (yet really not all that different from the old recording) as the third single was not a good choice to maintain interest in a new album.
But a lot will depend on how the rest of the songs on the album are regarded - or not.
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Post by Alan on Oct 29, 2021 11:37:25 GMT
Alan, read my post above yours about Supermarkets. Yes, sorry, I didn’t see your post until after I’d posted mine. Oops. |
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Post by gamleman on Oct 29, 2021 11:38:43 GMT
I think we have to realise that for the vast majority of people who we hope will be buying "Voyage" (that is 'Joe and Jane Public'), JAN will be completely new to their ears and many people may not ever be aware that it's an old composition or not even care that it is. I think this 'old vs new' debate is a fan thing and won't have much bearing on ABBA's image or the success of the album. Even to me, it is not a big deal that they have resurrected JAN, but I'll say it again... I just wish it had been JLT.
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Post by Alan on Oct 29, 2021 11:47:54 GMT
It is mocked for sounding like the Wombles, especially the intro. They really should have edited that intro off. The instant I heard it, the Wombles sprang to mind. It certainly wasn’t a case of “it vaguely reminds me of something but I can’t think what”. To anyone of a certain age, in the UK at least, it will have been obvious. “Remember-member-member what a womble-womble-womble you are”. After that, it does become a bit difficult to take the rest of it seriously. Just listened to the CD on a decent CD player and it doesn’t sound great. I hope it is better on the album. |
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Post by gamleman on Oct 29, 2021 12:23:37 GMT
Do you think that the 'Wombles intro' (which I wouldn't have recognised, not being a Wombles fan) was a nod to the interval act of the Eurovision Song Contest 1974, which was... The Wombles! Indeed, they probably know Mike Batt (who created The Wombles) as he was one of the lyric writers for the English version of the musical "Abbacadabra".
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Post by bat on Oct 29, 2021 12:34:55 GMT
Even to me, it is not a big deal that they have resurrected JAN, but I'll say it again... I just wish it had been JLT. I'm loving JAN, can listen to it over and over again. Didn't know much about it until recently, so it feels new to me and it's good to hear A & A's young voices. I think it will be a pleasant change of pass song on the album. It's joyous fun. For someone who has just heard JLT over the last few months, I don't get the love for it. It's mid temp song that doesn't go anywhere for me and I tend to agree with B&B. May be controversial. |
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Post by HOMETIME on Oct 29, 2021 12:39:16 GMT
Despite my age, the Wombles similarity completely passed me by and, even when it was pointed out, it left me shrugging. It's bog standard boogiewoogie piano that has driven many a BAO track in recent years. I very much doubt that the Wombles even fleetingly crossed the minds of anyone in the studio. Maybe I'm alone in this, but it doesn't bother me at all.
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Post by madonnabba on Oct 29, 2021 13:13:36 GMT
The intro to JAN is my least favourite bit with that Womble connection. Can't believe someone close to them did not advise them of the undesirable comparisons...I would have said that needs to go. Just launch into the ahas and I would have repeated the end lyrics into the fade. However the lyrics are better than The very awkward JLT. JAN is a fun song but improved lyrics would have helped. If I had to rate JAN in the singles line up...and spilt the singles into top drawer.middle and bottom drawer. I would have it in the middle drawer. Bottom drawer containing Under Attack and So long.
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Post by HOMETIME on Oct 29, 2021 14:57:02 GMT
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Post by richard on Oct 29, 2021 15:00:29 GMT
A good test of a tune for me is whether I think it stands up on its own without supporting bass notes or chords. Playing JAN that way, I think ithe melody is very good. It's just that in my imagination the melody would have sounded even better with a different arrangement, jettisoning the boogie elements, keeping the tempo, of course - to match the original vocals - and adding strings to highlight the flirty, romantic aspects of the lyrics. I think Benny and Bjorn, for once, missed a trick there.
But I appreciate that many like the track just as it is.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2021 15:27:59 GMT
Just a Notion is ABBA's worst performing single and only 3 results in....
Germany #36
Sweden #44
Netherlands #73
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Post by madonnabba on Oct 29, 2021 15:33:59 GMT
Had Abba returned in 2008 , all the singles would have been at least top 5 and possibly the first two , number one. However the album should still do well. Wonder how Westlife's new single is doing?
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Post by gamleman on Oct 29, 2021 15:42:05 GMT
Wow, all three ABBA singles in the Retro Singles Top 10 (UK, I assume).
Nobody really reacted to my suggestion of a connection between JAN and Eurovision 1974, probably because they thought it was a silly idea, but I am now wondering whether it is actually real. Some people have noted a similarity between JAN and "Waterloo" (IMO slight) and also the 'Wombles intro'. Could JAN be ABBA's way of linking "Voyage" back to where it all started for them (if we ignore the "Ring Ring" album that wasn't initially released under the ABBA name and had a rather restricted release)? The Wombles thing could be completely tongue-in-cheek and hardcore ABBA fans are not getting it because they're taking JAN more seriously than B&B intended, and are perhaps judging the new material against where ABBA left off 40 years ago.
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Post by justabba on Oct 29, 2021 15:42:23 GMT
Had Abba returned in 2008 , all the singles would have been at least top 5 and possibly the first two , number one. However the album should still do well. Wonder how Westlife's new single is doing? It came in at 66 last week... |
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Post by madonnabba on Oct 29, 2021 15:53:59 GMT
That just shows that even Westlife who could do no wrong at one point have struggled too with the streaming effect. I now question how accurate the streaming figures are? Does a person have to listen the track in its entirety, if you have the same track on five favourite track lists does one listen count as 5, does radio plays count . And who checks for accuracy.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2021 16:03:59 GMT
MadonnaAbba - the first two singles were #1 and #2 in the Sales Chart. ISHFIY getting to #1 but DSMD having the better chart run.
Yeah, if we still had 100% sales charts all the songs would have done much better.
You only need to play a song for 30 seconds for it to count as a listen. Older people tend not to stream do much.
Gentleman, it could be tongue-in-cheek but joke fallen flat! The Wombles, I believe were the interval act at 1974 Eurovision.
Elton John is #1 in the album chart with 31,000 sales. It would be a shame if ABBA fail to get to #1 despite sales of 100k -200k and kepr behind Ed Sheeran.
Voyage's release timing is terrible!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2021 16:25:31 GMT
Considering ABBA were so well known for their production quality, can anyone guess why they allowed JAN to be released as it was? Don't get me wrong (don't shut me down)!, I do like the song, but it doesn't sound as good as I would have expected. Could it just be because the old and new parts don't technically go together well? Would it have sounded better doing everything from scratch?
On a separate issue, I must admit that I would have preferred the chorus vocals on ISHFIY to be more prominent, but I am guessing they wanted a more 'live' feel? For me, the biggest draw has always been Agnetha and Frida's vocal chemistry.
But I am so looking forward to the album, I have a good feeling about it! I believe the best is to come!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2021 16:44:25 GMT
Alib - I think JAN sounds a bit cobbled together! Now and then combined not working on that song...lol
JAN has failed to make Irish Top 50
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2021 16:49:38 GMT
JAN #59 uk
#1 PHYSICAL
#4 SALES
#9 DOWNLOAD
SALES CHART
ISHFIY #45 - RE-entry
DSMD #47
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Post by HOMETIME on Oct 29, 2021 16:58:47 GMT
...and ISHFIY goes up from 23 to 10 in the vinyl chart. All in all, a good showing a week ahead of the album. I imagine there may be people holding off on paying for physical and/or downloads in favour of the album itself.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2021 16:59:27 GMT
Maybe Benny had The Wombles' 'Minuetto Allegretto' somewhere in the back of his mind when he was working on the intro for 'Head Over Heels'...  JAN does get quite a bit better with a few listens, but it's never, ever an ABBA single (either in 'old money' or new). Likely to deter as many potential 'Voyage' purchasers as it brings on board, so a net neutral impact at best, I'd have thought. On the basis of no evidence whatsoever, whatever JAN's merits, I simply cannot believe there wasn't/isn't a better candidate for pre-release album-teasing third single if they were determined to go down that route. Picking up on madonabba's excellent proprietary drawers-based ranking system for ABBA singles, I'd say that (at best) JAN fell down the back of the middle drawer and into the bottom drawer, where it may work its way towards the front over time. JFYI, I Do x5 languishes right at the back of the bottom drawer under the old underwear that really should be put out in a charity bag. And 'So Long' is top-drawer, I think you'll find! While it may have got slightly buried and hidden from immediate view, that doesn't mean it's not there! |
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Post by gamleman on Oct 29, 2021 17:05:34 GMT
Those chart positions are rather disappointing. I don't really understand how it can be only #9 in the Downloads chart when it has been #1 or #2 in the Amazon downloads all week, and I think the only places you can buy downloads these days are Amazon and iTunes. Johnny, if the Wombles intro is Benny's sense of humour, I don't think it has fallen flat. I rather like it, as it acknowledges the event that brought ABBA to my attention. Btw, it might be your predictive text but my username is not gentleman but gamleman, as in "Hej Gamle Man" (Hey Old Man) - I'm not technically an old man yet but sometimes I feel it  |
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Post by gamleman on Oct 29, 2021 18:08:07 GMT
Well, here is some more cheery news... today, the German group Groenalund have finally released their version of "Just Like That", which they have tried to make as close to the ABBA demo as they could. I think it's rather good and I wish them the best of luck with it.
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